This transcript has been lightly edited for clarity and readability.
Aaron: So you’re returning for a second go at the community board this election. This is always an interesting question after the first three years – what surprised you? What have you learned about being on the inside of Council? Or do you even feel like you’re on the inside when you’re on the community board?
Ross Wallis: Interesting question. It’s been a pretty steep learning curve. You come in thinking one thing, and the reality is different. I guess it’s about the influence we can have on Council. That’s the thing I’d like to see built on more. What I’ve found is that it’s hard to get influence at a community board level, but I think it’s doable, and there has been some good work done.
Aaron: Is that just around the fact that the community board is an advisory body – you don’t really have your hands on the levers of power in any real sense?
Ross Wallis: I think it’s more about understanding what our role is. Sometimes you come in thinking you can directly make changes, but really, you can influence change. It’s about working together to get the most influence you can. We do have two councillors on the community board, and that’s a starting point–having them on board and allowing them to take the board’s view back to council. That’s really our role as advisory. We’re almost like a lobby group for the Raglan community.
Aaron: A lobby group, but with slightly better privileges [laughs]. So what have you done during this term? I’ll ask everyone coming back this–what do you feel you’ve achieved during the three years?
Ross Wallis: To be honest, it’s probably taken three years just to get my head around how everything works and what we can realistically achieve. Plus, it’s very much a part-time role, and with farming as well, life gets busy. I’d love to be more involved in both the community and the community board–that’s really my goal for the next three years, get a lot more involved in our community. There are so many amazing things happening locally that I’ve been unaware of, I suppose we’re kind of rural, and it was only last year that we were really brought into the Raglan area.
Personally, I’ve enjoyed taking on the role of funding representative. That’s something I’ve been able to do with the time I had. But there’s so much more than that. As a community board, I think we’ve done some good things, and a lot of it is probably a holdover from the previous three years. One of the learnings I’ve had is that it takes quite a bit of time for things to funnel through. The likes of Dennis, Tony, and Chris–those guys have been there for a couple of terms–and a lot of the benefits we’re seeing now, like the finishing of the wharf, really came from the influence they had. And it’s not all about Council either. It’s about tapping into other revenue streams and opportunities. So yeah, it’s quite broad. Well, that’s an understatement. [laughs]
Aaron: It’s interesting, isn’t it? Every time we get a change of government, they either put in or take out those “wellbeings” things. But what I notice is that when members of the public come to the community board, they don’t think in those terms. They seem to expect you to just be community leaders–in all areas of life, really.
Ross Wallis: That’s fair
Aaron: And do you ever say to people, “That’s just not something we do,” or explain what you can and can’t do?
Ross Wallis: Yeah, I think there’s an expectation. We’ve probably got to be better at communicating what our role is, what we actually do, and what we can achieve. There’s probably expectations from the community about what the board can or should do, which doesn’t really line up with what we’re able to do – the board has very limited powers and ability to make change.
But where our strength lies is in the relationships we develop and cultivate, and I think that’s really key. I’m quite excited about this next election and the diversity of people coming onto the board, because I think a diverse board is absolutely critical for Raglan. We need people from all the different parts of our community represented, so we can have good, robust discussions and challenge Council in the areas where we can actually influence change.
We’ve got to be able to work together. That’s the key. We’re not there just for our own group. It’s about recognising the diversity around the table, coming to consensus, and working together. It’s not about me going in with an agenda and trying to force it through–it just doesn’t work.
That’s why I got involved in the community board, because it’s an environment I really enjoy and thrive in. And in terms of diversity, I’d hate to have six farmers sitting around the board table.
Aaron:That would be a very strange election result, wouldn’t it?
Ross Wallis: 100%
Aaron: For people who might only be vaguely aware, the Raglan Community Board area was extended three years ago to include the communities of Te Uku, Te Mata and Ruapuke. Waitetuna is just slightly out – there are restrictions on exactly where those boundary lines can be drawn.
Do all the people out there know they’re now part of the Raglan community board area?
Ross Wallis: Yeah, I think so. Part of the benefit of being the funding representative was having the chance to support projects in those areas. We were able to provide funding for the Te Uku Hall and the Te Mata Hall, giving some seed money for the big projects they’re working on. Things like the Te Mata tennis courts have helped raise awareness that those communities are now part of the Raglan board area.
Aaron: That actually makes me think Council should have increased the size of that fund, because by extending the community board area they’ve also increased the number of communities that might apply for it.
Ross Wallis: Yeah, absolutely. Although, to be honest, I really don’t like the term “discretionary fund.” When we’re living in the times we are now, I don’t think many families in Raglan have a discretionary fund of their own.
Aaron: I want to ask this next question in both directions. First of all, as a rural person, what have you learned about the urban community over these last three years?
Ross Wallis: To be honest, how much is happening in Raglan. It almost overwhelmed me – the number of things we could get involved in, the number of community groups doing so many amazing things. It was almost overwhelming, because you’d love to be over all of it, and you just can’t be. So you divvy it up, with the time you’ve got. That’s probably the biggest thing.
Aaron: What about what we in town need to understand about the rural community that’s now part of our community board? What don’t we know?
Ross Wallis: To be honest, I know in New Zealand there’s always talk about this growing rural–urban divide in New Zealand, but I don’t really feel that. I actually feel well supported by the urban community as a farmer – as a whole. And I think farmers are doing a lot more these days to help urban communities understand what we’re doing–especially around environmental issues.
The biggest thing is recognising that if you pull one lever, it affects something else. When I was on the Fonterra Shareholders’ Council years ago, we went to Wellington to do a kind of Agriculture 101 with MPI policy makers. The message was simply: if you make a decision in isolation, it just doesn’t work–you have to include everyone in the process. As farmers, we need to include the urban population in what we’re doing too, so there’s understanding.
Once you start explaining that if you make a decision out here on policy, and you pull that lever, actually it has ongoing effects and you have to take those into account and look at the whole, And actually, in Raglan, I find that holistic approach is better understood than in a lot of other places.
Farming isn’t just about making a profit–it’s also about looking after the environment and being socially aware of what’s happening around me. So the biggest thing is just understanding that you might have a real desire in the environmental space but just understanding that if you pull one lever there, it’s going to have effects in another place. So what’s the best way to get that outcome, with as little disruption as possible, so that holistically, we can actually be sustainable.
Aaron: That’s a really good way to look at it, because I’m also interviewing the Regional Council candidates, and that council has a lot more to say about environment and farming issues. It’s such a weird beast, the Regional Council. It’s hard to get enough donein the time I have with a guest, and I don’t understand as much about it myself. It’s more challenging to fit them into 25 minutes.
But anyway, the next thing I want to ask, there’s been a media campaign to make rates a national election topic, and all the new candidates are talking about it. So, coming back to the question I asked before: what effect can the Community Board actually have on rates, before we get into what you think about them?
Ross Wallis: Well, the effect we can have is by going to meetings. I went to an LTP meeting where they were talking about budgets for the next 10 years, and I was able to look more closely at where the money was being spent and highlight some concerns. But I’m not sure how much effect that really has, because the process is long, and by the time you get into it, it’s probably almost too late.
Rates feel really unsustainable to me. I’ve been thinking about this quite a bit, because you can’t just stop and say, “Well, that’s it.” As a farmer, with interest rates the way they’ve been, we’ve been under a lot of pressure, and we’ve had to look hard at our budgets–just like families in Whāingaroa or Raglan. You end up saying, “We can’t afford this, so we’re not going to spend it.”
It’s frustrating when you go to Council and see projects still going ahead that look more like “wants” than “needs.” That’s why I’ve been a bit uncomfortable, even as the discretionary funding representative, because most people don’t have a discretionary fund themselves. So should we? And what should we actually be looking to fund?
Aaron: Couldn’t you argue that If most people don’t have discretionary spending, then it’s all the more important to have that discretionary [fund] spending?
Ross Wallis: Yeah, and you could. Absolutely. That’s a discussion we should have, and that’s why it’s important to get everyone’s view on it. I’ve got a view that’s swirling, and it’s good to hear others. But what I’ve really seen in councils is that governance has changed. The governance of councils is in the hands of those we vote in. It still feels like a bit of a popularity contest, rather than appointing people with the skills to actually do the job. I’m not saying they’re not doing their best–they are–but I think we need to be clearer about electing people with the capability to handle governance roles.
On the other side, you’ve got council staff who see elected members come and go, and historically they’ve just carried on doing things the way they always have, because they know councillors will change. It’s like a big ship and it’s really hard to turn a ship around quickly.
If I was on council, I’d be asking: what kind of reset do we need to really look at how things are being done? Because rates are getting out of control. They’re well above inflation, and it’s not sustainable. It breaks your heart to see families who’ve lived here all their lives, or elderly people, finding it unaffordable. We’ve got to do something about it.
Aaron: I’m very aware that it’s getting harder and harder for people to pay rates. What worries me is that it’s related to the wider state of the economy. We’ve got the working poor–both parents working, yet still can’t get enough money. We’ve got kids going to school hungry. This winter they’re talking about the cost of electricity, and we all know what’s happening with housing.
I’m worried this is a bigger-picture issue, and asking councils to solve it doesn’t seem fair when they don’t control the root causes. But having said that, even though councils don’t control the cause, they still have to make decisions.
Ross Wallis: 100 percent. I think it’s a societal problem. I think we’ve drifted as a society. And if I think back to Allan Savory, who talks about holistic…agriculture
Aaron: Oh the guy from Zimbabwe?
Ross Wallis: Yeah he talks about finance. He said, as a young man at university, he never had enough. Then he got his first job, got a pay increase, and still never had enough. It always gets taken, because that’s just what we do.
I’ve been thinking about this myself over the last few months. I think we tend to live beyond our means, as opposed to doing without some things like our grandparents did. From a farming perspective, he said take your gross revenue, split it in half, and put half aside. That’s what you’ve got to spend on for the farm. If you’re doing capital improvements, then maybe you take from that half. But unless you do something drastic like that, you’ll never have enough.
So I can’t just blame council for it. It comes down to us as a society. And I’m the same–I spend when I don’t need to.
Aaron: There are some slogans out there, and I’m frustrated at the debate being held nationally at the level of slogans. Everyone should be frustrated about that. One of the solutions people throw around is “back to basics.” But if you look at the way council money breaks down, the basics already form the vast majority of the spending.
So maybe we should look at how easy it would be to take some from roading? It’s the biggest part of the budget. I don’t actually have an opinion about that, but I do know some of our rural roads have been suffering over the last few years. They’ve turned into a bit of a mess.
Ross Wallis: Yeah, look, it’s hard. You always see things, “oh that just seem a waste”. But in the big scheme of it, when you look at the whole budget, they’re actually quite small and won’t make much difference. I also understand the argument my grandparents used to make–you save your pennies, and that’s how you get ahead.
Aaron: Yeah, our grandparents, that generation, they didn’t have much to start with. I think mine were old enough to remember the Great Depression. So aside from rates–which I don’t think community board members spend much time on–what is the job actually about?
Ross Wallis: I know what it should be about. It should be more about engaging our community. That’s where I feel like I haven’t done a great job personally, because I want to engage more, but it’s just a time thing for me. That’s my goal for the next three years – to get around the community more, understand what’s happening, and understand the issues. For me, that’s the key for the community board: actually understanding the issues and then trying to affect change that way.
To be honest, it sometimes gets a bit depressing, because you feel like you’re hitting your head against a brick wall. But I think we are making incremental changes. For instance, looking at the town and the growth plan, actually getting a plan for Raglan and how it expands, and having some input into that. Going forward, that’s quite an exciting avenue. And we are making progress in discussions with Council, and there is a willingness to understand that.
At the moment it feels a bit haphazard, the way things go.
Aaron:I think everyone would agree with that.
Ross Wallis: I guess having Council take a bit more of a proactive approach as opposed to reactive. Right now it’s more reactive – based on developers wanting to do something, and they probably get frustrated and just plough ahead. I remember the first meeting I sat in and I said to the Council staff there, roading, wastewater, everything else, “It looks to me like the way Raglan is expanding is as if we asked, how can we make your job the most difficult? Because this is how we’re going to expand.” Instead, we should be asking, “How do we want to grow, and how can we do it sustainably without blowing budgets out?”
Aaron: I worry that the reactiveness speaks to a lack of vision. And I think vision is really important. The thing that frustrates me about rates dominating the discussion is that, while important, having a vision for the community is important.
Do you have a personal vision for the community, or a sense of the overall vision for this area? It’s a big question, I know.
Ross Wallis: Yeah, it’d take a bit of thought. I’m always reminded of talking to some of the older local Māori about what this area was – a place of rest and peace. For me, that’s a big part of what Raglan is. It’s not going to be a major economic hub. It’s always going to be a seaside town that attracts people and visitors in the summer because we have so much to offer. So it’s about embracing who we are at our core, rather than trying to create something we’re not designed to be. I think you’re right – we probably need to spend more time on that. A lot has already been done through Raglan Naturally and other initiatives.
Aaron: We’re coming up to the end of the interview. Are you a person who might be a chair on the community board? I’ll ask that question, and you can say no comment if you want.
Ross Wallis: Potentially, yes. I’d definitely be open to that. It’s something I have experience with and could do. I’d step into it, but it would require me to be more available, and I’d need to balance that with my farming business. But yes, that would be a goal. We’ll see how things work out and what the next three years look like.
Aaron: For people who don’t know, the chair is elected by the fellow community board members. Voters don’t participate in that process. Do you think people should be able to have a say in that? What do you reckon – just off the top of your head, we didn’t plan to talk about this.
Ross Wallis: Yes and no. It depends if you have a stable community board. If the board is all new, and members don’t know each other, it’s difficult. I know in other areas we’ve elected a chair for the following year before everyone retires, because the outgoing members know the people.
Aaron: Okay. Do you have a pitch, or anything you want to say about why people should vote for you?
Ross Wallis: Not really [laughs].
Aaron: It’s funny – the people running for Mayor are very organised with their pitch, but as you go down the scale to the community board, it’s more like, I’ve just come in from work, and here I am.
Ross Wallis: [laughs] Yeah, I’d be honoured to serve in this capacity again, but it’s up to the community if they want me. I feel I have the skills and abilities to do it, and I understand the community board and its role better now. Everyone always says it takes a term to get your head around it, and then you’re not allowed to leave, you need to stay on to be useful. So I don’t want to waste the last three years.